Having Rosa Parks Body in the Rotunda of the Capital is Disgraceful

(Action Greens thread)

In a message dated 11/2/05 11:10:13 AM, frank writes:

i think having rosa parks body in the rotunda of the capital is disgraceful. we don't need anymore co-opted freedom fighters to add legitimacy to this abomination called the US GOVT!!!

peas,

frank

Nov. 2, 2005

It opens the possibility of gaining awareness for those less aware or conscious. It sets a precedent that legitimizes (in gov protocol terms) those who have fought valiantly for freedom.

Even if this gov is corrupt, there are still people within (in the minority still) that are not corrupt.

Rhio

Nov. 2, 2005

While I think it does send a good message (that activists can achieve important change in American society, and are worthy of celebration), let's not forget the people we're dealing with-they're trying to use this to cover their own anti-minority (especially anti-African-American) misdeeds and prejudices. Just as Condi is the token Black face of the admin, as Powell was before her, Rosa Parks gives them the appearance of caring without really having to do anything inconvenient like doing things to truly help. Don't let any warm fuzzies fool ya-they're really corrupt.

mark

Nov. 3, 2005

yeah, but it also tends to form an opinion in those "less aware" people, that associates this crimminal govt with the working class heroes, whom they fought tooth and nail and then some, and are continuing to fight every step of the way to justice and fairness for workers and the poor. it's the sole reason it was allowed to happen.

the govt's war on workers just got a shot in the arm from this travesty.

what were rosa parks wishes in this matter i wonder?

would she've been happy being placed on view inside the belly of the beast, or is she rolling in her grave at the stupidity of the so-called leaders who arranged this.

peas,

frank

Nov. 3, 2005

I don't think that I'm likely to let any "warm fuzzies" fool me. I know they (the Bushies in power) are corrupt, they may not even be redeemable, at least in this present incarnation. But in the larger picture, corruption is an idea and an idea can be changed and reworked and reformulated and refined and upgraded… and transformed completely into something new. And when the corruption-prone person lets go of the corrupt idea or the corrupt way of proceeding in business and in life, then there is the possibility that it can be replaced by a better idea, a more wholistic idea, an idea that benefits all, instead of just the few. We have to believe in redemption, we have to believe in epiphanies, don't we?

But what are we really talking about here? On the one hand we are against a brutal senseless war, and we know that killing, killing, and more killing is unconscionable. But on the other hand, some of us feel or have the feeling that we cannot sit down and negotiate with people who think differently than we do. But it has to be one or the other, doesn't it? – war or negotiation. And I choose negotiation, diplomacy, negotiation, good will, negotiation, reason, negotiation, common sense, negotiation, leverage, negotiation, intelligence strategies, negotiation, plain intelligence, negotiation until I'm blue in the face and then negotiate some more but not one drop of blood to be shed. And for it to finally be as we envision, we have to believe in the vision and focus on the vision of what we want MORE than focusing on what we don't want. People can change their minds as we see the American public is doing right now. They may be sleeping somewhat, but that's only because of the collusion of the media which doesn't allow equal time to all ideas. The more they could hear other ideas, the more the sleeping giant would be awakened.

What we focus upon – that's what we bring into our reality. A simple example: Let's say we want a nice green lawn (I think lawns are a waste of land – better to plant fruit & veggies) – but getting back to my example – we focus on a nice lush green lawn, and then the tiny, thin blades of grass start to appear, but they are not lush yet, but yes, they are coming. Should we say at that point, "Oh look at these puny little blades, they are not full, they are not lush, what good are they?" – or should we say "Hey, this is the beginning of that lawn I want – it's coming towards me and I welcome it and let it come".

And that's why Honoring every single small gain that we make brings us closer to our goal. Can people distort these things? Of course, we've been doing it all throughout history, but I do have faith in the (uncommonly) common people, look what's happening in Venezuela and in other parts of South America. Let the common people finally see, and they'll act and they'll be the pivot on the fulcrum for change.

Working mostly in the health information field, I've learned that some people with illness learn to live with their illness, they get used to it, they get attached to it, it becomes comfortable for them. Letting go of that idea and replacing it with the idea for robust health is not how they are used to seeing things. An analogy for us to let go of the struggle – and believe in the outcomes of our own making.

Please let's not allow ourselves to become jaded… because then our own resistance works against achieving what we really want.

Rhio

Nov. 3, 2005

Remember those Paul Robeson and Malcolm X U.S. postage stamps?

You can barely get them today.

The sophisticated enemy always tries to appropriate the heroes of those it oppresses. For the oppessors, this is a tactical question, for by doing so they also spread the popularity and in some sense legitimize those who fought all their lives against the system run by the oppessors.

Same with Rosa Parks (and of course expect to find her face gracing a new postage stamp — probably when they raise the rates again). The enemy of course is trying to appropriate her, twist around her meaning. But the enemy is not monolithic, and it represents a victory for the oppressed every time we force Power to concede to our demands — even when we know they will be co-opted.

The same is true about ANY reform — higher wages, cleaning up pollution, etc. That is why it is so important that the consciousness of people be high, so that we understand what is going on and resist co-optation when our strength is able to force through some of our demands (say, ending the war in Iraq).

Think dialectically, por favor.

Mitchel

Nov. 3, 2005

One little note — I don't know how Rosa Parks actually envisioned her act, or what she was protesting, whether it was Southern Jim Crow or the bigger picture of US hegemony, imperialism, whatever. But a clue is that she showed up for one of Clinton's State of the Union addresses, and was quite pleased with the standing O that she got. I kind of doubt she thought of herself as being coopted. I think she'd look at the present veneration she is getting as a celebration of her role in a great victory.

David

Nov. 4, 2005

what great victory?

racism and the war on the workers and the poor goes on unabated!

does victory mean being paraded in the rotunda of the white man's house? ok we won, now let's forget about everything and go back to sleep.

are the knicks on tonite?

frank

Nov. 4, 2005

For starters, I was speculating on what Rosa Parks thought, not commenting on what I thought was a great victory. But for the record, I'd say that dismantling Jim Crow is a mighty great victory. And I suspect she'd agree. But I haven't heard anyone claim the war's over. So perhaps you can roll the straw man back into the closet?

David

In a message dated 11/5/05 2:33:42 PM, frank writes:

corruption IS the end result of all the plans and ideas, with one sole purpose in mind. control.

i've even seen some, what i like to call "nazis for the left" who are for most of the same things i'm for, but who think they know the best way to go about it, and everybody else is wrong. fucking eliteists

frank

Nov. 6, 2005

If corruption is the end result of all plans and ideas for you, then why are you still an activist, since you can't believe in any different outcome?

Rhio

Nov. 8, 2005

the end result of all CAPITALIST and eliteist plans. sorry for not being specific.

frank


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